Thanks to:
"Gernot M. Fuchs" <gfuchs_at_golay.med.unc.edu>
przemek_at_rrdjazz.nist.gov (Przemek Klosowski)
koen vandenbussche <busschek_at_sebb.bel.alcatel.be>
lionel_at_quark.enet.dec.com (Steve Lionel)
sam_at_stdavids.picker.com (Sam Goldwasser)
sorry if I missed anybody: dxmail just messed up my Mail directories.
================================
Summary seems to be:
- DEC VRT17-PA (actually VRT17-HA with VGA-to-BNC cables)
is identical to Sony 17se
- To get good pictures on a high quality monitor,
use a high quality graphics card... (and cables)
Following combinations have been reported to work without problems:
- Gernot M. Fuchs:
VRT 17 - HA, Diamond Stealth 2000 Video (with MPEG hardware),
Diamond drivers, Win95,
or: LINUX, standard S3 drivers
- koen vandenbussche:
VRT17 HA, ATI MACH64 card with 4MB RAM & MPEG decoder in 1024x768 70Mhz
non-iterlaced mode, mach64 driver, configured as NEC MultiSync 4FG, on
Win3.11/WinNT
- Steve Lionel:
DEC Celebris FP590 PC, (integral S3-864 graphics), Win95,
monitor configured as "Digital PCXAV-EC"
My original question on Tue, 19 Mar 1996 was:
Has anybody successfully connected a DEC 17" monitor VRT17-PA to a
Intel-based PC? How? Which graphics adapter? Which driver?
(Convergence problems with SPEA V7 MIRAGE P-64 graphics card under Windows95)
========================================
Additional Information:
- The cable was not my problem, I use the same cable on the workstation and on
the PC.
- External magnetic/electric fields were not my problem:
moving the monitor around/to another room did not change a thing.
- I checked sync pulses and colour information with an oscilloscope. Results:
graphics card (PBXGA-AA = ZLXp-E1) on the DEC workstation: (picture good)
(1280*1024 _at_ 75Hz)
vertical sync pulses 2.1 Volts high, 40 microseconds wide
horizontal sync pulses 2.5 Volts high, 1.24 microseconds wide
graphics card (SPEA V& MIRAGE P64) on one PC: (picture bad)
(1280*1024 _at_ 71Hz)
vertical sync pulses 1.5 Volts high, 700 microseconds wide
horizontal sync pulses 1.5 Volts high, 0.54 microseconds wide
graphics card (Hercules Dynamite) on the other PC: (picture bad)
(1024?*768? _at_ 72Hz)
vertical sync pulses 2.1 Volts high, 100 microseconds wide
horizontal sync pulses 2.1 Volts high, 1.8 microseconds wide
So, there _ARE_ big differences, BUT Sam Goldwasser said, that if a monitor
locks to the frequencies (obviously it does) then the pulse height/width
should not be a problem.
- the timings between sync pulses and start of colour information of the
SPEA graphics card can be modified by using the program "SPEAtune",
BUT there is no change in picture quality.
- the polarity of the sync pulses, can be altered on the SPEA:
the picture jumps horizontally by about an inch, BUT the quality of
the picture does not change.
Summary: It must be the layout of the graphics card itself that causes the
colour convergence problems (although it uses the same video chip S3-864 as the
DEC Celebris PC).
========================================
My posted messages:
To Newsgroups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.video
I bought a new 17" monitor from DEC, VRT17-PA, which I believe is
(nearly?) identical to the Sony 17se. (82kHz)
Problem is: When running on the alpha Workstation with PCI-graphics
adapter ZLXp-E1 the monitor is really fantastic.
When connecting to my PC, equipped with a SPEA V7 MIRAGE P64
(2MB DRAM) I get severe convergence errors: on the upper edge the
right half gets a red line, on the left edge the lower half gets
a blue line (or was ist vice versa?). In the center the picture is
good, but near the colored edges you cannot read the letters without
pain to the eyes...
I used different frequencies, different resolutions, but I got no
enhancement of the quality of the picture.
I connected to another PC with a Hercules VGA Card resulting in the
same color problems. So I suspect it is not a standard VGA Monitor.
On the other hand, the Sony 15se shows the same problems, but to a
much smaller degree. An this IS a VGA monitor...
Has anyone tried something similar? Any hints how to use this
monitor on a PC?
--------------
To mailing list: alpha-osf-managers_at_ornl.gov
To newsgroups: comp.unix.osf.osf1,comp.sys.dec,comp.os.vms,comp.sys.dec.micro,
vmsnet.alpha
has anybody successfully connected a DEC 17" monitor VRT17-PA to a
Intel-based PC? How? Which graphics adapter? Which driver?
Is this monitor identical to a Sony 17se?
Can anybody list the differences in the technical specifications (e.g. timings)
between this monitor and a "standard" PC monitor?
Can I operate a DEC ZLXp-E1 PCI graphics card in an Intel-based PC and then
connect the VRT17-PA to it?
Which drivers for Windows95? Where from?
Background information:
We bought an AlphaStation 600 5/266 with a ZLXp-E1 graphics adapter and the
already mentioned VRT17-PA monitor. Xwindows applications on DU display O.K.
(excellent picture) on this combination.
We use this workstation as a kind of server, so we don't need the console
display, and I tried to attach the monitor to a PC (Motherboard: ASUS SP3G)
with a PCI graphics card: SPEA V7 MIRAGE P-64. (video chip: S3 Vision864,
RAMDAC ATT20C498/ATT21C498, up to 135MHz, 2MB graphics memory) (this has
been successfully operated before with a Sony 15sf)
Result: Dramatic Convergence problems at the upper right and lower left
border. Cannot be corrected with the built-in monitor controls. Same
problems at all available frequencies, resolutions and jumper settings
(Maybe I missed some combinations of these parameters :-)
Similar results with a new Hercules graphics adapter (don't know the exact
model) on a different PC.
Picture is visible at all frequencies, so this monitor is _NOT_ a
fixed-frequency monitor as were the old DEC ones. Seems as if the fly-back
timing is different compared to "standard PC" monitors. Is it possible to
change the timings in the S3 chip on the graphics card? How?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
received messages:
From: "Gernot M. Fuchs" <gfuchs_at_golay.med.unc.edu>
Hallo!
Ich weiss nicht ob das hilft, aber ich habe hier einen VRT 17 - HA an einem
Alpha Server 2000 (Compaq QVision PCI SVGA Adapter), den ich problemlos an
einen PC mit Diamond Stealth 2000 Video (mit MPEG Hardware) anschliessen habe
koennen und zwar sowohl unter Win95 als auch unter LINUX. Der Windows Treiber
war der von Diamond gelieferte Diamond Treiber, unter Linux habe ich den
standard S3 XServer verwendet.
Hoffe das hilft etwas ...
--Gernot
--
Dr. Gernot M. Fuchs University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
voice: 919-966-3263 UNC Hospitals/School of Medicine
email: gfuchs_at_pasteur.med.unc.edu CB #7260, Chapel Hill, N.C. 27599
www : http://russell.med.unc.edu/~gfuchs
-------------
From: "Gernot M. Fuchs" <gfuchs_at_golay.med.unc.edu>
Hallo!
Also ich habe bei mir einfach folgendes gemacht: Nachdem ich meinen PC hier
temporaer ans Netz anschliessen wollte um Software zu ueberspielen, und ich
hier nur Macs und SGIs und DECs habe, habe ich mir gedacht, ich probiere den
Monitor vom Alpha Server aus, da der ja PCI und VGA hat, und ich daher
Kompatibilitaet erwartet habe.
Ich habe auf meinem PC Windows 95 laufen mit einer Diamond Stealth Video (das
ist die mit MPEG Hardware). Ich verwende die Treiber von Diamond selbst und
nicht die von MS. Ich fahre mit 1024x768 Pixel und 24 Bit Farbtiefe. Die
Bildqualitaet war auf Anhieb ausgezeichnet, nur die Scanflaeche des
Elektronenstrahls hat etwas angepasst werden muessen.
Allerdings habe ich zu Beginn auf meinem PC mit dem Originalmonitor Probleme
mit der Bildqualitaet gehabt, da die mitgelieferten MS Treiber nur interlaced
arbeiteten. Nach einigem Herumdoktern habe ich dann die Diamond Treiber
verwendet und von da an war die Bildqualitaet exzellent.
Also im Prinzip kann ich sagen, dass bei mir das Umstaecken des Monitors von
der Alpha auf den PC - wie sagt man so schoen - Plug 'n Play war. Die
Bildqualitaet ist genauso gut wie auf dem Alpha Server, die Farbtiefe ist sogar
noch besser, aber das ist ja eine Sache der Treiber und der Graphikkarte.
Gruesse
--Gernot
----------------------
From: przemek_at_rrdjazz.nist.gov (Przemek Klosowski)
The monitor setup is really simple: there are only 9 parameters to
consider:
dot clock
horizontal scan times: before sync, sync, after sync, visible pixels
vertical scan times: before sync, sync, after sync, visible lines
Your problems may be due to sync pulse parameters that don't jibe
with the monitor. I don't think you can modify those in Windoze drivers.
If you really want to investigate this, you could run Linux X server
which allows you to change the parameters.
Actually, are you sure that your cables are OK? I could imagine that
they could be the source of your troubles.
-----------------
From: koen vandenbussche sf900 3167 <busschek_at_sebb.bel.alcatel.be>
sorry for the late responce. I use my 17" monitor (VRT17 HA) on an
ALPHA 200 4/100 and Pentium PC without any problem. I configured my
PC screen as a NEC MultiSync 4FG. The graphical card on my PC is an
ATI MACH64 card with 4MB RAM & MPEG decoder in 1024x768 70Mhz
non-iterlaced mode. I use the mach64 driver who was delivered with
the graphical card. Everything works perfect under Windows 3.11 and NT.
I don't use the Windows95 shit, maybe their exist a version for
Windows 95, I don't know.
I think that the graphical card is the reason of throubles not the driver.
Koen
______________________________________________________________________________
Koen Vandenbussche
mail: busschek_at_sebb.bel.alcatel.be
_
V
+-----------------------+
| A L C A T E L | Alcatel Telecom, Dept. WE 234
+-----------------------+ de Villermontstraat 38 Voice: +32-3-450.3167
TELECOM B-2550 Kontich, BELGIUM Fax: +32-3-450.3551
______________________________________________________________________________
From: lionel_at_quark.enet.dec.com (Steve Lionel)
In article <314FCB32.41C6_at_Physik.Uni-Karlsruhe.de>, Rainer Landes
<Rainer.Landes_at_Physik.Uni-Karlsruhe.de> writes:
>
>has anybody successfully connected a DEC 17" monitor VRT17-PA to a
>Intel-based PC? How? Which graphics adapter? Which driver?
>Is this monitor identical to a Sony 17se?
As far as I know, it is identical. For Windows 95, you can use the monitor
type "Digital PCXAV-EC", which is the same monitor and is the one I am
looking at that is attached to my Celebris FP590 PC. I'm not exactly sure
what the difference in the -PA variant is, but it is evidently restricted to
supplied cables. Use it as a standard (superb) PC monitor - up to
1280x1024 resolution at 75Hz, EnergyStar, MPRII compliant.
Steve Lionel lionel_at_quark.enet.dec.com
Fortran Development http://www.digital.com/info/slionel.html
Digital Equipment Corporation http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/
110 Spit Brook Road, ZKO2-3/N30 Steve_Lionel/
Nashua, NH 03062-2698 "Free advice is worth every cent"
For information on Digital Fortran 90, see http://www.digital.com/info/hpc/f90/
--------------------------
From: Steve Lionel 01-Apr-1996 0850 -0500 <lionel_at_quark.ENET.dec.com>
What is this SPEA video card? I am using this monitor on my Celebris PC
(integral S3-864 graphics) and it is fine. I suggest a new, more mainstream
video card.
Steve
------------------------
From: sam_at_stdavids.picker.com (Sam Goldwasser)
If the picture locks, I doubt that sync is your problem. The VGA output
is supposed to be TTL for sync but in practice this can vary quite
a bit. The DEC onitor probably terminates the sync perhaps 75 ohms so it
is being loaded down from its normal TTL. (You can measure the resistance
at the sync connectors with an ohmmeter). However, I doubt that this is
your problem. Are the scan rates the same?
Also, are you sure you mean convergence? What are the symptoms?
--- sam
====================================================================================
End of Summary
Rainer Landes eMail: Rainer.Landes_at_Physik.uni-karlsruhe.de
Tel. (+49) 721 608 3578 http://fphvax.physik.uni-karlsruhe.de/
Computer facilities of the Faculty of Physics, University of Karlsruhe, GER
Received on Wed Apr 03 1996 - 16:08:55 NZST