-- Stephen Dowdy - Systems Administrator - CS Dept - Univ of Colorado, Boulder dowdy_at_cs.colorado.edu - 303-492-6196 - http://www.cs.colorado.edu/~dowdy/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 12:09:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Joanna Gaski <jgaski_at_WPI.EDU> Subject: CSLG Licensing and "clone" Alpha system If you look on Digital's CSLG Update pages, you'll see that they say they will not allow CSLG to cover any clones purchased after July 1, 1997! Of course, this wasn't in anyone's licensing then, and last I heard (about one month ago) it had still not made it into the licensing. Actually, it seems to directly contradict the written licensing agreement (system eligibility rules for CSLG coverage). Anyhow, we purchased several clones before finding out about the CSLG restrictions, and Digital decided to let us cover those with CSLG, although they said that no further clones after these would be covered. The CSLG people we spoke with were Linda Clark, Chris During, Dave Giovanni, and Brian Kennedy. I don't see how they can enforce the clone restrictons if those are not in their formal licensing agreement, but I don't have the legal expertise to challenge such a thing. It is also clear that they can make the licensing arbitrarily restrictive, and that the only choice universities will have about this is whether or not to stay with CSLG, as the licensing is signed on a year-to-year basis. I have also heard from various people (vendors, other admins) a rumor that this decision is not firm. I have heard from others that Digital simply will not be enforcing it. I have heard that some universities are just ignoring it. Despite all these rumors, what you will get from the CSLG licensing group is that clones are not covered, and will not be in the future. If you press them, they may agree to cover clones bought before you knew, as they recognize that the restriction is not in the licensing. As a final note, Linda Clark is the head of the CSLG licensing group, and was very understanding about our particular dilemma. Brian Kennedy is the CSLG legal person, and the person to whom I had to speak about our licensing; he was less understanding. His job seems to have been to say no, despite any ethical concerns, or even logical contradictions. Anyhow, good luck. I fear that having universities make noise about this issue may not change DEC's decision, but it can't hurt. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Jul 98 12:16:30 -0400 From: "Dr. Tom Blinn, 603-884-0646" <tpb_at_zk3.dec.com> Subject: Re: CSLG Licensing and "clone" Alpha system CSLG is a marketing program that differs in terms of its details from country to country throughout the world. So the answer you get from someone in, say, Europe (where some countries have already placed such a restriction) may or may not have any bearing on what happens in the U.S. As I understand the logic behind the CSLG program, the thought was that by "giving away" software licenses for campus use, this would reduce the real cost of Digital branded workstations and make them competitive with those from some of the other UNIX vendors (such as Sun, who traditionally offer very deep discounts to "buy" the business). Of course, it makes no sense to do this if you're not providing the hardware at or near full price, with the consequent profit margin to offset the loss of software revenue. The fact that no one has "fixed" this marketing program in the U.S. when Digital was not the hardware vendor is probably because it was viewed as either too much trouble to enforce, or as not good business for other reasons, including loss of customer good will, and because the total volume of system units has been small. Plus, the real goal is to increase the use of Digital's products so even if we didn't manufacture the box (just the motherboard), it's in our interest to have the end customer (you) running our software. But not all of the people involved see things that way. It's really unclear whether Digital merged with Compaq will continue to try to aggressively pursue either a UNIX workstation business or the education market in the same ways as before. And whether there will be changes in the CSLG program in the U.S. will depend on that kind of marketing decision. I doubt you will find anyone outside of the management decision makers who can even make an informed guess. Tom Dr. Thomas P. Blinn + UNIX Software Group + Compaq Computer Corporation 110 Spit Brook Road, MS ZKO3-2/U20 Nashua, New Hampshire 03062-2698 Technology Partnership Engineering Phone: (603) 884-0646 Internet: tpb_at_zk3.dec.com Digital's Easynet: alpha::tpb ACM Member: tpblinn_at_acm.org PC_at_Home: tom_at_felines.mv.net Worry kills more people than work because more people worry than work. Keep your stick on the ice. -- Steve Smith ("Red Green") My favorite palindrome is: Satan, oscillate my metallic sonatas. -- Phil Agre, pagre_at_ucsd.edu Yesterday it worked / Today it is not working / UNIX is like that -- apologies to Margaret Segall Opinions expressed herein are my own, and do not necessarily represent those of my employer or anyone else, living or dead, real or imagined. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 9:51:22 -0700 From: System Prestidigitator <BOLSON_at_frango.hs.washington.edu> Subject: RE: CSLG Licensing and "clone" Alpha system I don't think it is a rumor. I think it is TRUE. You should look at the CSLG web site for the contract language, but I don't believe clones are acceptable for CSLG (there may be exceptions for particular companies, and Compaq might change the policy, of course). ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 12:45:10 -0500 (CDT) From: Larry Tague <ltague_at_physio1.utmem.edu> Subject: Re: CSLG Licensing and "clone" Alpha system I have not heard this rumor, but if they do not allow the use of he CSLG, they will be shooting themselves in the foot. I currently have three Aspen system machines running DU, and being in a university, I use the CSLG for my multi-user access. DEC needs to decide how much of their business should be hardware, and how much should be software!! Larry Tague Co-Director of MECCA* Research Associate Dept. of Physiology & Biophysics Phone Bus.: 901-448-7152 U.T. Memphis Phone FAX: 901-448-7126 894 Union Ave. e-mail:ltague_at_physio1.utmem.edu or Memphis, TN 38163 ltague_at_mecca.mecca.org *MECCA (Memphis Educational Computer Connectivity Alliance) URL: http://www.mecca.org/Received on Mon Jul 13 1998 - 20:32:24 NZST
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